Great info! I've only recently become aware of how important translation is. I was looking at getting the Waterfield translation of Epictetus and I may now get that version of Meditations as well!
You're right, Andrew, I don't read ancient Greek, which makes it all the more important for me to gain as much context to Marcus' Meditations, as possible. I was not originally familiar with the historical background, or specific Stoic-centric references when I first read The Meditations. I am hardly an expert now! But if we are to base these translations on 1 passage:
- The Hays version of 2.1 is very readable.
- Hard gives us a note to consider and points us at a page and half of the Introduction to review for further understanding/discussion.
- Waterfield's version of 2.1 provides us with no fewer than 8 direct annotations to consider, many of which point us at multiple other sections of MA's Meditations (12 references?) to review for further insight.
For me personally, the amount of effort that Waterfield has expended to provide us with background information; cross-references to other related passages in the book; potential contradictions; and the details of the characters that MA is referring to, all make Robin Waterfield my go-to translation.
He has provided me with similar insights in his translation of the "Complete Works - Epictetus".
:) Yes, it would save me from having to use 3 different bookmarks in the Complete Works! I think he's got about 165 pages of notes. Lots of to'ing and fro'ing, which can occasionally become distracting, but am v grateful for them.
Apologies! Only 65 pages of notes. He does explain why he has chosen not to add them as footnotes, but it would have saved me from flipping back and forth. They're still extremely useful and illuminating, tho'. Taught me a lot.
The translation can have a huge effect on how one understands the text. My favorite example is Outlines of Pyrrhonism. There's a huge difference between the Annas & Barnes translation (currently the most commonly cited) and the one by Benson Mates. Mates' translation is far superior because the critical technical terms he just transliterates, making it clear about what technical vocabulary is essential.
Great info! I've only recently become aware of how important translation is. I was looking at getting the Waterfield translation of Epictetus and I may now get that version of Meditations as well!
You're right, Andrew, I don't read ancient Greek, which makes it all the more important for me to gain as much context to Marcus' Meditations, as possible. I was not originally familiar with the historical background, or specific Stoic-centric references when I first read The Meditations. I am hardly an expert now! But if we are to base these translations on 1 passage:
- The Hays version of 2.1 is very readable.
- Hard gives us a note to consider and points us at a page and half of the Introduction to review for further understanding/discussion.
- Waterfield's version of 2.1 provides us with no fewer than 8 direct annotations to consider, many of which point us at multiple other sections of MA's Meditations (12 references?) to review for further insight.
For me personally, the amount of effort that Waterfield has expended to provide us with background information; cross-references to other related passages in the book; potential contradictions; and the details of the characters that MA is referring to, all make Robin Waterfield my go-to translation.
He has provided me with similar insights in his translation of the "Complete Works - Epictetus".
Agreed. Waterfield's notes are great, and his translation of Epictetus is also fantastic, though I wish he'd stuck with the footnotes for it.
:) Yes, it would save me from having to use 3 different bookmarks in the Complete Works! I think he's got about 165 pages of notes. Lots of to'ing and fro'ing, which can occasionally become distracting, but am v grateful for them.
Apologies! Only 65 pages of notes. He does explain why he has chosen not to add them as footnotes, but it would have saved me from flipping back and forth. They're still extremely useful and illuminating, tho'. Taught me a lot.
The translation can have a huge effect on how one understands the text. My favorite example is Outlines of Pyrrhonism. There's a huge difference between the Annas & Barnes translation (currently the most commonly cited) and the one by Benson Mates. Mates' translation is far superior because the critical technical terms he just transliterates, making it clear about what technical vocabulary is essential.
Did Gregory Hayes just release a new translation dated November 13th? Looks like he did. It’s on Amazon; publisher MA Publishing Press.
Besides the older one, I do see A Hayes Meditations ebook from 2023. Not sure exactly, but sometimes publishers will pay to produce their own version.
https://www.amazon.com/s?i=digital-text&rh=p_27%3AGregory+Hays&s=relevancerank&text=Gregory+Hays&ref=dp_byline_sr_ebooks_2
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